+60 votes
by (9.2k points)
Something to take note of. Is anyone building sites with no link building doing well during the current May algo update?  
Something to take note of.

45 Answers

+46 votes
by (6.4k points)
 
Best answer
No links, no drops
+1 vote
by (1.6k points)
@dimorph28475 is the founder of Link Research Tools (LRT) for those who don’t know. Still think it’s too early to jump to conclusions, but an interesting potential idea to follow.  
+23 votes
by (550 points)
I saw some drops in my clients ccTLD sites
+49 votes
by (570 points)
No links no drop. period
+54 votes
by (2k points)
No links. still dropped
0 votes
by (440 points)
No links and doing really well. Ranking skyrocketed over the past 2 weeks.  
by (1.3k points)
How did you manage that? Well done.  
by (630 points)
@peyton448 also curious
by (440 points)
@zillion Nothing fancy. Normal SEO, content focused. All local SEO, solid internal linking, and most of our efforts are in user experience.  
+7 votes
by (4.4k points)
Funny because the conversation on @mossbunker (with people in his group, not with Matt) right now is sites only relying on on-page are dropping and authority sites aren't.  
by (5.4k points)
Totally agree, my authority sites went un-touched but the ones I was barely building out with little to no links lost the little bit they had going for them.  
by (4.4k points)
We just need to wait it out for a couple weeks and then react. But right now any adjustments we make in reaction to the update could make things worse.  
by (650 points)
@keitloa Huh? A conversion with me? Or a conversation about me? I haven't made any conclusions whatsoever about the update.  
by (350 points)
Still blaming you for disavowing all my backlinks
by (4.4k points)
@mossbunker no, not at all. I said 'a' conversation 'on' - as in your group. I didn't say 'with you. ' Sorry if that was taken the wrong way. Not meant that way at all. I've added some verbiage to my comment to clarify. Really sorry if I ruffled any feathers.  
+39 votes
by (1k points)
Who knows? Never see any of those no link unicorn sites in the top 2 pages of search.  
by (560 points)
Me either bro.  
by (3.7k points)
They dont exist
+43 votes
by (590 points)
I have 3 or 4 sites that went from the bottom of page 1 or top of page 2 to the top 1-4 spots for our money keywords so Im really happy right now. No active link building on any of them and the link profiles have been relatively flat for years. They originally dropped after the Jan update but now theyre all stronger then before.  
+18 votes
by (600 points)
About 90 referring domains here. Got 3 new links at the beginning of May. Rankings skyrocketed.  
+3 votes
by (460 points)
I haven't seen any major changes in general, let alone a difference between links/ no links. I'm still kind of sitting here nervously waiting for the algo to hit my sites lol
+53 votes
by (1.8k points)
Yep, one of my sites has hit the front page for it's money keyword. No link building whatsoever, but the market is poor when it comes to digital marketing.  
by (2.4k points)
@krakau2013 How is the competition like?  
+50 votes
by (750 points)
So what should you do, build links faster? What about if your site is already aged and you didn´t build links fast enough, is it too late?  
+12 votes
by (2.7k points)
Yup, disavow everything, kill all link building. SMH. Just keep doing what you were doing to your site 3 days ago. Things will re-adjust.  
by (550 points)
@trinitrophenol "Things will readjust" - not necessarily.  
by (2.7k points)
Mohammad, yes perhaps the drops will be permanent for some sites, of course. That still doesn't mean they should start guessing what to "fix" right now.  
+59 votes
by (2.6k points)
I think they are also updating how snippets are won.  
+58 votes
by (990 points)
Yes (link building is not a strategy for specific reasons but there ARE some links from legit sources). But I don’t think that what we are seeing is necessarily generalised.  
+19 votes
by (570 points)
I don't do much SEO anymore, but my affiliate sites (all of which are content only, never touch link building) seem to be picking up
+20 votes
by (1.6k points)
I didn't link build and this site of mine which has weathered through previous updates lost about 40%. Big brands like Amazon are on top. So does competitors with tons of links.  
+40 votes
by (2.1k points)
Yeah, no link building and sites have gone up. Just doing basic maintenance to speed things up and touching up structured data. No link building. Outranking Amazon and the manufacturer for review related queries. I checked a former client that I had built links for last year but stopped last spring and they're at the top, #1. I don't know if it's because of on page changes, under hood changes or because their competitor is an aggressive link builder.  
by (1k points)
@giordano82 same!  
by (340 points)
The few I've checked that dropped (very small sample) seem to have low quality, obviously "built" link profiles. One day people will learn that PBN and Web 2. 0 links don't work forever.  
+44 votes
by (4.7k points)
No links, haven’t actually checked analytics for a couple of days SEM rush is telling me my keywords are up (only have a free account), and just nabbed a featured snippet overnight that I’ve been chasing for a year.  
+55 votes
by (580 points)
This would make sense in my case. I’ve been getting negative SEOd over a year. So naturally, going to have a bit of negative velocity as links get deleted or spammed out sites go inactive. I’ve dropped over 60%
by (340 points)
Can I ask what vertical you've been seeing negative SEO in? I've seen quite a bit in the health vertical.  
+30 votes
by (580 points)
No links built and still dropped!  
+37 votes
by (1.1k points)
It's just stupid right. What's the difference between getting links and receiving links organically or (negatively) from your competitors? Googles system must be flawed then. As if receiving backlinks is a bad sign. This must be more than just 'getting/receiving/building backlinks'.  
+45 votes
by (1.8k points)
When Google will prioritize sites according to content by removing the "authority" segment, then only I think link building will stop.  
+38 votes
by (3k points)
I never worried about any update. each update is just pushing me bit or more up. just do things “naturally” and that’s it, “great” content, some link building in common sense level and that’s it. so much drama about every update. how you guys sleep from so much stress.  
by (550 points)
@hiltonhilum569 LMAO keep that attitude up, and when an update hits you eventually (it will), you will be humbled. Remember this.  
by (3k points)
@meletius thank you. I will.  
by (550 points)
@hiltonhilum569 Trust me, you will.  
by (3k points)
@meletius please check your rankings this morning, there is a new update out there.  
by (5.2k points)
I'm with you John. :) For the past 8 years. I was hit twice, but for the short time by Google's misjudgments and errors. They have fixed it quickly. Every other update did slight or huge boost, or sometimes nothing. I agree that we never know with big G. But that would be interesting to see. So far all updates made more or less sense except the ones favoring some big players.  
by (3k points)
@fiddlefaddle exactly my point . and your last sentence about big players , when they rip you off that's ok, but when you rip them off you get lawsuit or something similar  
+9 votes
by (2.9k points)
Yes, I manage 150 sites in travel, vast majority of which (so far) are seeing improvement. We do no active linkbuilding at all
+41 votes
by (1.7k points)
It implies that sites with positive link velocity trend should rise But it's not the case. My 1+ year old autogenerated websites are soaring. They're on expired domains with strong backlinks. sooo.  
by (3k points)
@palazzo how auto generated?. if you don’t mind explaining. curious. thank you.  
by (1.7k points)
@hiltonhilum569 I scrape data and texts and use them
by (3k points)
@palazzo thank you.  
+4 votes
by (1.7k points)
Did anyone see an update report based on niches? Ecommerce, affiliates, news, informational content, and business websites all have different intent and should rank differently. What about YMYL niches?  
+4 votes
by (3.6k points)
These rankings will all fluctuate. Core updates roll out slowly. Anyone saying otherwise is pushing their own agenda.  
by (610 points)
Not necessarily they could also be over reacting to fluctuations without an agenda.  
by (3.6k points)
@florie true but to hear what's supposed to be an established expert overreact usually means they're just trying to get their voice out there to be seen/heard. Facts be damned.  
by (610 points)
@demoss176 Yes indeed.  
+30 votes
by (740 points)
I have a blog where I just post content, let google do the work and it's been tripling in size for the last few months. No link building at all
+43 votes
by (2.2k points)
I do have customers without active link building that did not lose and are still on a rise. @kissinger might have found a clue here, but as always in SEO it is probably only true if other circumstances are also met . or if other circumstances are not met.  
+3 votes
by (730 points)
For my testing, it appears to be based on links. i have a few test sites with super thin content that got big boosts. see example
by (350 points)
What tool is this?  
by (730 points)
@hogtie serprobot
+43 votes
by (730 points)
I'm actually wondering if this is a hit to citation sites. I am seeing large increases on some map listings with little to no citations but optimized content and good backlinks.  
by (3k points)
@raneeraney interesting observation. last few days one of friends GMBs is first on three pack, 11 reviews, never anything posted, no optimization whatsoever blah blah blah. he has two GMBs and two websites for the same thing, other one is “authority” for the same thing, always in three pack, website first and so on. now that “bad” one is suddenly first on three pack last few days without almost any citations or optimization ‍♂️
+7 votes
by (1.5k points)
In this thread a couple of phrases caught my eye I have to question  1. "No links? " - which website has no links? You mean you did not engage in active link building. OK. maybe next item 2. You don't "believe in links". Ok man, I'm out. 2. "No link building"? You probably still have links. Believe it or not, legit sites get links either way over the years. Don't have to be many. 3. Negative SEO causes Negative Link Velocity? Maybe, maybe not. 4. You see a drop from 117 to 95 ref domains in Ahrefs/Majestic/Semrush and still rank? Man, this has nothing to do with the Link Velocity Metrics I talk about. We look at past 6 / 24 and 6/12 and 4 to 24 months. I don't even know where to get that data in any other product besides LRT If you have some sites for me to check, I'm happy to collect them here, or via PM (then) and look deeper. That'd be awesome. Thanks for your interest! Yes, I know Google said it takes 2-3 weeks to rollout to their 100. 000 servers. As usual. So what? Effects we see today are effects we can look at today. Let's not pretend we can sit this out.  
by (610 points)
Hey man, PM is on its way
by (610 points)
Im trying not to freak out but traffic has dropped 3 days in a row and it really stings! Its got so bad Im gonna take the day off and clean my flat.  
by (2.9k points)
@kissinger Have PM'd you
by (740 points)
Surely the term link building is the active task of bulding links for your site? Passive linking isn't an act of link building
by (3k points)
Voice of reason :)
+48 votes
by (2.2k points)
Well given theres no natural linking, one would really expect the sites with high link velocity to be punished, as that group is where the link spammers are.  
by (1.5k points)
Why is there no natural "linking"?  
by (2.2k points)
@kissinger do you not know?  
by (1.7k points)
@didynamous do you know what "viral" means?  
by (2.2k points)
Sure - but how many plumbers can get their site to go viral? It works for some content - but that content type is not what I am talking about here. Of course I have heard of viral - who hasnt? A lot of people can make a celeb page or stupid joke or political post go viral - now how many people can get a local electrician, or plumber, or roofer, or tiler, or brick layer site to go viral? And of course, natural linking to some content types still occurs - but I dont think anyone in their right mind would think that a local plumber will get natural links like a kim kardashian major event would. Tell me otherwise.  
by (890 points)
@didynamous I've seen local tradesman on the news many times in my lifetime. But only when they've done something noteworthy. E. g. if a local brick layer tried to break a world record perhaps.  
by (2.9k points)
I agree with @didynamous on this one. Very few sites do not have manufactured linking. Natural linking does happen but even with viral content, it is usually paid for and manufactured in a way to attract those "natural" links.  
by (4.4k points)
Plumbers with naked ladies. That content can go viral ;) Sorry but I couldn't resist. Yes I was in computer repair - just like plumbing no one gives a crap about it until they need it. Then they want it yesterday. It's really difficult to get content to go viral unless it's entertaining or very interesting. Home services businesses are neither until the need comes up.  
by (2.2k points)
@keitloa confessions of a window cleaner!  
+52 votes
by (540 points)
No link building, traffic doubled over the last 30 days. Niche site
+35 votes
by (1.3k points)
Gotta love our industries obsession with links . I’m not in the no link camp by the way guys, you do need them but it’s funny how obsessed we are. We’d rather write long form content that’s all over the place. We think that a site visitor wants the history of apple trees, cider making and how Newton was climbing that apple tree when he discorvered gravity. They only googled best red apples and wanted to know the best price. My go to would be looking at the content and making sure it still matches the same intent as when it was written. Also that Google hasnt changed the intent. Get it in a document and flag it accordingly, at least you are doing something productive. Then when the dust settles if your rankings arent what they where, then you have a plan of attack. Truth is. Google is very good (not perfect) at ignoring shitty links. Because if they werent when they made Peguin real time back in 2017, the spammers would negative seo every decent site with shitty links they cant win any other way.  
by (370 points)
@dagney you love your intent now  
+51 votes
by (4.2k points)
Negative link velocity assumes you had some positive link velocity to start. There's no way to lose velocity before you've gained it. When he says "Very Negative" in that screenshot, I wonder if he's not saying "losing links" as compared to "not gaining them as quickly as before. " Hard to know from that.  
+16 votes
by (1.7k points)
Mr LRT has the tools too see patterns. @kissinger does your crystal ball see over what time frame has done the most damage? i. e sites that lost links over the last 3-6 months or sites that had a large % of link loss in any time frame.  
+8 votes
by (890 points)
That's the only remaining negative SEO strategy that works well so I would be surprised if they made it an algo update after the whole penguin + negative SEO thing. @kissinger what are you defining "very negative" as?  
+44 votes
by (4.4k points)
It's hard for me to think over the loud sounds of poor linking strategy. Negative only effects those that didn't future proof themselves. Without knowing sources or what have you, in times past footprints were usually the culprits of then and now. Is this individual under attack?  
+10 votes
by (11.4k points)
Yeah, I don't build any unnatural links because I'm never sure on what I'm getting with the niche edits and PBNs (real link builders charge $1000+ a month for a few links). All my sites are up for their money pages. but this isn't over yet.  
+28 votes
by (1.7k points)
Have one site where I haven't built link the last 2 years. Has not dropped. Medium competition. Good content though. No new link from others neither.  
+20 votes
by (3.8k points)
Killing it in algo. No unatural link building. Some disavow files are 2000+ deep and Google is loving on those sites.  
+25 votes
by (9.2k points)
I've got onces with filthy dodgy ones going up. Still moving around to much for me to be sure what the deal is yet
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